The dangers of allowing religion to influence government

[Guest Weary&Disgusted]

Ideally, a government serves the best interest of its people, and looks to foster good relations with other nations.  In actuality, geopolitics are significantly shaped by the never ending quest for hydrocarbons.  Its unfortunate that the nations of the world are all oil and gas junkies, and that this largely dictates their foreign policy, but we accept it as the way of the world.  What I find more alarming is an increasing trend for the current US government to be influenced by loony fringe elements of the Evangelical churches.  The reason I mention this is that some of the more extreme forms of evangelicals appear to believe that before Christ can establish his kingdom on earth, it is first necessary for an "end times" bloodbath to take place in the middle East.  Worryingly, these "Christians" seem to be okay with the prospect of some large scale battle taking place somewhere in the vicinity of Israel, because this will supposedly usher in the second coming.  So this big time loss of life almost seems to be eagerly anticipated, because its a prerequisite to Jesus returning to earth.  

If this was just something some backwoods nutters subscribed to, it wouldn't be much of an issue,but increasingly, these people appear to have the ear of the president, and unfortunately its not outside the realms of possibility that their mutterings about "Gog and Magog" may be starting to influence American foreign policy.  

One preacher named John Hagee has apparently been calling for a war between American and Iran for years now.  He doesn't seem to be bothered about all the people who would get killed in the crossfire, as long as its fulfilling his beloved biblical prophecy, its all good in the hood. 

As I say, in any sane universe, these people would be ignored or sectioned, but both Pence and Pompeo are also reportedly evangelicals, so its hard to tell how much they buy into the fringe beliefs.  With Trump moving the US embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem in 2016 ( which didn't exactly help the Israeli Palestine talks), and then ordering the killing of Soleimani ( who admittedly had a lot of Western blood on his hands, but was also doing a fantastic job of exterminating Islamic State and Al Q militants in the area up until the point he was blown into smithereens), it makes me nervous about the future and nostalgic for the good old days when governments were primarily motivated by black gold and natural gas rather than questionable interpretations of cryptic biblical prophecies.  

[Guest Weary&Disgusted]

A link to an article with more anxiety inducing details :

https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2020/01/evangelicals-are-anticipating-the-end-of-the-world-and-trump-is-listening/

[White Cunt]

It’s difficult to assess the true extent of anyone’s true religious convictions underlying their political machinations; they are usually deliberately put on display to solicit a specific response of full support from the “faithful” to any planned invasion/oppression, etc. The green faith washing of criminal intent is part and parcel of selling unpalatable and very expensive military campaign to the gullible ones.

[Dave Umbongo]

No mention of a magical ring and I can't imagine Israelis saying, winter is coming. Sounds like a really shit movie, I'm out.

[Guest Weary&Disgusted]

6 hours ago, White Cunt said:

It’s difficult to assess the true extent of anyone’s true religious convictions underlying their political machinations; they are usually deliberately put on display to solicit a specific response of full support from the “faithful” to any planned invasion/oppression, etc. The green faith washing of criminal intent is part and parcel of selling unpalatable and very expensive military campaign to the gullible ones.

Yes, agreed.  Pompeo apparently makes reference to the Rapture and miracles in his speeches, but this could quite possibly be him just establishing his credentials with the voters back home. I think when Trump referred to himself as "the chosen one" he must have been struggling to keep a straight face.  I genuinely hope he doesn't buy into this.  We don't really want someone with access to nukes to subscribe to nightmare prophecies which require large numbers of people to die horribly.  

[Guest Weary&Disgusted]

38 minutes ago, Cunty BigBollox said:

No mention of a magical ring and I can't imagine Israelis saying, winter is coming. Sounds like a really shit movie, I'm out.

It IS a really shit movie, and if I could be an extra in a different story, I would gladly jump ship.  

In fact there's an idea, maybe it should be compulsory for everyone in the whitehouse and the pentagon to watch "Dr Strangelove" once a year.  Just to prevent life from imitating art.  

[King Billy]

3 hours ago, Weary&Disgusted said:

Yes, agreed.  Pompeo apparently makes reference to the Rapture and miracles in his speeches, but this could quite possibly be him just establishing his credentials with the voters back home. I think when Trump referred to himself as "the chosen one" he must have been struggling to keep a straight face.  I genuinely hope he doesn't buy into this.  We don't really want someone with access to nukes to subscribe to nightmare prophecies which require large numbers of people to die horribly.  

The only problem with this nonsensical scaremongering is the fact that Donald J Trump is the first US President in modern times who hasn’t started a single war and who has pulled US troops out of conflict zones around the world where they had been sent by previous dishonest, corrupt, warmonger presidents.

[Guest Weary&Disgusted]

1 hour ago, King Billy said:

The only problem with this nonsensical scaremongering is the fact that Donald J Trump is the first US President in modern times who hasn’t started a single war and who has pulled US troops out of conflict zones around the world where they had been sent by previous dishonest, corrupt, warmonger presidents.

Believe me KB, I would be more than happy to be proved wrong on this one.  Hopefully Pompeo is not susceptible to this stuff either... But its difficult to know for sure.  

 

[ChildeHarold]

21 hours ago, Weary&Disgusted said:

Ideally, a government serves the best interest of its people, and looks to foster good relations with other nations.  In actuality, geopolitics are significantly shaped by the never ending quest for hydrocarbons.  Its unfortunate that the nations of the world are all oil and gas junkies, and that this largely dictates their foreign policy, but we accept it as the way of the world.  What I find more alarming is an increasing trend for the current US government to be influenced by loony fringe elements of the Evangelical churches.  The reason I mention this is that some of the more extreme forms of evangelicals appear to believe that before Christ can establish his kingdom on earth, it is first necessary for an "end times" bloodbath to take place in the middle East.  Worryingly, these "Christians" seem to be okay with the prospect of some large scale battle taking place somewhere in the vicinity of Israel, because this will supposedly usher in the second coming.  So this big time loss of life almost seems to be eagerly anticipated, because its a prerequisite to Jesus returning to earth.  

If this was just something some backwoods nutters subscribed to, it wouldn't be much of an issue,but increasingly, these people appear to have the ear of the president, and unfortunately its not outside the realms of possibility that their mutterings about "Gog and Magog" may be starting to influence American foreign policy.  

One preacher named John Hagee has apparently been calling for a war between American and Iran for years now.  He doesn't seem to be bothered about all the people who would get killed in the crossfire, as long as its fulfilling his beloved biblical prophecy, its all good in the hood. 

As I say, in any sane universe, these people would be ignored or sectioned, but both Pence and Pompeo are also reportedly evangelicals, so its hard to tell how much they buy into the fringe beliefs.  With Trump moving the US embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem in 2016 ( which didn't exactly help the Israeli Palestine talks), and then ordering the killing of Soleimani ( who admittedly had a lot of Western blood on his hands, but was also doing a fantastic job of exterminating Islamic State and Al Q militants in the area up until the point he was blown into smithereens), it makes me nervous about the future and nostalgic for the good old days when governments were primarily motivated by black gold and natural gas rather than questionable interpretations of cryptic biblical prophecies.  

Marx said politics followed economics. Perhaps religion comes first? Anyway, my view is that religion is essentially a cloak for economic greed or exploitation, or a cloak for political aims. 

[Eric Cuntman]

1 minute ago, ChildeHarold said:

Marx said politics followed economics. Perhaps religion comes first? Anyway, my view is that religion is essentially a cloak for economic greed or exploitation, or a cloak for political aims. 

Religion also serves as a smokescreen for all manner of sexual perversion and sick behaviour. Providing an excuse for dog-collar wearing paedophiles to have access to vulnerable children.

Q) what's the difference between a cult and a religion?

 

A) in a cult, there's some cunt at the top who knows it's all a load of bollocks. In a religion, that cunt is dead.

[ChildeHarold]

Just now, Eric Cuntman said:

Religion also serves as a smokescreen for all manner of sexual perversion and sick behaviour. Providing an excuse for dog-collar wearing paedophiles to have access to vulnerable children.

Q) what's the difference between a cult and a religion?

 

A) in a cult, there's some cunt at the top who knows it's all a load of bollocks. In a religion, that cunt is dead.

Still there is a basic social need shown from the earliest humans in the Stone Age with their careful burial customs to today with the institutions of religion. Also it has acted as a cultural catalyst - like the art of the Counter Reformation - or the pilgrimage churches of Bavaria. We have so little culture in Britain its easy to under-estinate the influence of the Church in Western Europe. The Catholic Church in particular was a crucial patron of the arts, the Assisi Chapel Frescoes of Giotto are a private commission but without the Catholic Church wouldn't have come about. Most of our cuktural landscape is underpinned by religion whether we like it or not. In Britain in most areas or places the church is the only decent building. This is particularly so with tje absence of civic values or public buildings or even a public realm... the begrudging attitude continues and thete is little or no private or corporate philanthropy in Britain. 

[Guest Weary&Disgusted]

1 hour ago, ChildeHarold said:

Still there is a basic social need shown from the earliest humans in the Stone Age with their careful burial customs to today with the institutions of religion. Also it has acted as a cultural catalyst - like the art of the Counter Reformation - or the pilgrimage churches of Bavaria. We have so little culture in Britain its easy to under-estinate the influence of the Church in Western Europe. The Catholic Church in particular was a crucial patron of the arts, the Assisi Chapel Frescoes of Giotto are a private commission but without the Catholic Church wouldn't have come about. Most of our cuktural landscape is underpinned by religion whether we like it or not. In Britain in most areas or places the church is the only decent building. This is particularly so with tje absence of civic values or public buildings or even a public realm... the begrudging attitude continues and thete is little or no private or corporate philanthropy in Britain. 

Harry, I agree that the church has had some positive effects, you highlight their role as sponsors of great artists, but they also created and protected many important libraries within the monasteries (when they werent busy trying to murder people who proposed alternate cosmologies like Bruno and Galileo) and indirectly gave a few helpful nudges to proto sciences when they were in their infancy.  

However, I take issue with "so little culture", the UK is packed to the gills with history and culture.  Its just that a lot of it isn't obvious and in your face.  Plus there is a lot of hidden/ underground culture which isn't readily shared with tourists and" newcomers", and many people never become aware of it.  Some people are viewed as newcomers until their family have been in the area for at least three generations.  

I'm sure there's at least a little bit of philanthropy.  The masons and the rotary clubs seem to make it a way of life. 

I'm kind of glad that the church of Rome had a much weaker influence here, tbh.  Protestantism was a lot friendlier to the development of science, so it gave us a bit of a head start, while Europe was busy killing some of their best minds as "heretics".  

[Guest Weary&Disgusted]

1 hour ago, Eric Cuntman said:

Religion also serves as a smokescreen for all manner of sexual perversion and sick behaviour. Providing an excuse for dog-collar wearing paedophiles to have access to vulnerable children.

Q) what's the difference between a cult and a religion?

 

A) in a cult, there's some cunt at the top who knows it's all a load of bollocks. In a religion, that cunt is dead.

Harsh but unfortunately true.  

[Guest Weary&Disgusted]

1 hour ago, ChildeHarold said:

Marx said politics followed economics. Perhaps religion comes first? Anyway, my view is that religion is essentially a cloak for economic greed or exploitation, or a cloak for political aims. 

It wasn't always that way, but the naive and idealistic yearning for the ineffable inevitably becomes buried as cynical sociopaths rise to the top of any growing hierarchy, unless there are subtle barriers in place.  Then the growing organisation becomes more about power, money and influence than contemplating the infinite.  Before you know it, some monarch in hock to your order wants to have you all killed as heretics rather than pay his annual interest bill, and it all ends in tears fire and blood.  

[Wolfie]

3 hours ago, ChildeHarold said:

Still there is a basic social need shown from the earliest humans in the Stone Age with their careful burial customs to today with the institutions of religion. Also it has acted as a cultural catalyst - like the art of the Counter Reformation - or the pilgrimage churches of Bavaria. We have so little culture in Britain its easy to under-estinate the influence of the Church in Western Europe. The Catholic Church in particular was a crucial patron of the arts, the Assisi Chapel Frescoes of Giotto are a private commission but without the Catholic Church wouldn't have come about. Most of our cuktural landscape is underpinned by religion whether we like it or not. In Britain in most areas or places the church is the only decent building. This is particularly so with tje absence of civic values or public buildings or even a public realm... the begrudging attitude continues and thete is little or no private or corporate philanthropy in Britain. 

Each time I sense I may be picking on you, you justify my behaviour by writing something so incredibly stupid you remind me of just how much of a thick fucking backwoods Cornish birdbrain I've suspected you to be all along.

The UK and its unique sovereignty of nations boasts more arts, literature, music, paintings, humanities, intellectual achievement, philosophy, performing arts and rich military history like no other nation on Earth. Whether you agree these cultural facts (in the manner with which they were achieved) to be right or wrong, the point is you cannot renounce the incredibly rich cultural history of the UK & British Isles.

'We have so little culture in Britian', yes? You obviously vapid, peanut-brained humungous Neanderthal oaf.

[King Billy]

58 minutes ago, Wolfie said:

Each time I sense I may be picking on you, you justify my behaviour by writing something so incredibly stupid you remind me of just how much of a thick fucking backwoods Cornish birdbrain I've suspected you to be all along.

The UK and its unique sovereignty of nations boasts more arts, literature, music, paintings, humanities, intellectual achievement, philosophy, performing arts and rich military history like no other nation on Earth. Whether you agree these cultural facts (in the manner with which they were achieved) to be right or wrong, the point is you cannot renounce the incredibly rich cultural history of the UK & British Isles.

'We have so little culture in Britian', yes? You obviously vapid, peanut-brained humungous Neanderthal oaf.

Whilst I can’t disagree with one single thing you’ve pointed out Wolfie I have to say that all your observations lead me to the conclusion that he is an absolute fucking cunt, which then reminds me that this is Cunts Corner. 

[Earl of Punkape]

Catholicism should be the religion of the whole planet and woven into the constitution of all governments and their politics.

All wars would end and sex would take place within the confines of marriage.

[Eric Cuntman]

13 minutes ago, Earl of Punkape said:

Catholicism should be the religion of the whole planet and woven into the constitution of all governments and their politics.

All wars would end and sex would take place within the confines of marriage.

Yes. All sex would take place within the confines of marriage...

..and within the confines of children's arseholes.

lol. Fuck off. ✝️

[Trucking Funt]

2 hours ago, Earl of Punkape said:

Catholicism should be the religion of the whole planet and woven into the constitution of all governments and their politics.

All wars would end and sex would take place within the confines of marriage.

Allow Satan into your life, he's far less judgemental than that scruffy cunt Jesus.

[Guest Weary&Disgusted]

7 hours ago, Earl of Punkape said:

Catholicism should be the religion of the whole planet and woven into the constitution of all governments and their politics.

All wars would end and sex would take place within the confines of marriage.

Its a nice dream, but even if we were all catholic, I'm sure some splinter group would find a pretext to justify attacking another group.  Mark of Cain and all that, murder is in our blood.  

[ChildeHarold]

11 hours ago, Wolfie said:

Each time I sense I may be picking on you, you justify my behaviour by writing something so incredibly stupid you remind me of just how much of a thick fucking backwoods Cornish birdbrain I've suspected you to be all along.

The UK and its unique sovereignty of nations boasts more arts, literature, music, paintings, humanities, intellectual achievement, philosophy, performing arts and rich military history like no other nation on Earth. Whether you agree these cultural facts (in the manner with which they were achieved) to be right or wrong, the point is you cannot renounce the incredibly rich cultural history of the UK & British Isles.

'We have so little culture in Britian', yes? You obviously vapid, peanut-brained humungous Neanderthal oaf.

Go and fuck yourself peasant. 

[ChildeHarold]

13 hours ago, Weary&Disgusted said:

It wasn't always that way, but the naive and idealistic yearning for the ineffable inevitably becomes buried as cynical sociopaths rise to the top of any growing hierarchy, unless there are subtle barriers in place.  Then the growing organisation becomes more about power, money and influence than contemplating the infinite.  Before you know it, some monarch in hock to your order wants to have you all killed as heretics rather than pay his annual interest bill, and it all ends in tears fire and blood.  

O I don't know. I think early Christianity was inevitably political because it challenged the religious foundations of Rome also inevitably when they became a persecuted minority. 

[Guest Weary&Disgusted]

2 hours ago, ChildeHarold said:

O I don't know. I think early Christianity was inevitably political because it challenged the religious foundations of Rome also inevitably when they became a persecuted minority. 

Aye, fair enough.

[Hammer of Cunts]

15 hours ago, Weary&Disgusted said:

I'm sure there's at least a little bit of philanthropy.  The masons and the rotary clubs seem to make it a way of life. 

In the UK, until the arrival of virtue signalling, advertising ones philanthropy was considered bad form. To grown-ups it still is.

[Guest Weary&Disgusted]

Quick update.  Totally off the record the Prez allegedly implied to one of his lawyers that he thought the evangelicals were thick as two short planks, so it doesn't look like he does buy into the prophecy of death after all.  Crisis averted, as you were.  

The jury is still out on Pompeo though...